When did you first start working at the Ponds?

I started working in ‘92 but I was at the Parliament Lido for a long time, apart from doing the odd shift up at the Ponds. Then I started working full time at the Ponds in 2006/2007. I was working in the Lido as a younger person and really enjoyed working there but, as I drifted into middle age, the Ponds became a bit more attractive. You don’t have all the kids and the same level of aggro. In a life guarding sense, it’s tougher at the Ponds because it’s a much bigger space, with murky and deep water. But the level of crap you’d have to deal with at the lido… even though it’s tougher at the Ponds, it’s just a nice environment to work in. I did feel at home at the Ponds quite quickly. I think that was an age thing and, as you do settle into it you become quite wrapped up in it in a way… it’s a very social job.

I mean, it did take quite a bit of getting used to… just suddenly finding yourself in an all-male environment, but then the more you get to know people and build up friendships and relationships, it becomes normal.

How does the community surrounding the Ponds add to the experience?

There's a lot of fascinating characters that come in, all sorts of people to be honest, and that's one of the nice things about it. Particularly the all-year-rounders. It becomes an unofficial sort of social club in a way, especially for the early morning swimmers. I mean… the busier we get, maybe that gets diluted a bit because I think more people coming, you kind of lose some of the tight community and stuff. But you know, it's gone quiet now and you see all the guys come out in the morning, people who have been coming here years. Then you have all the chitchat… quite a few go to a cafe or to have a cup of tea or wherever. So it does become that more informal, community based thing where it's not literally just about a bloke coming here and having a swim. There's obviously a lot more to the social side which is an important part of it.

We've seen the popularity increase quite sharply, all in relation to mental health. Whereas before that narrative was openly discussed, it was just seen as some weird, cranky, quirky thing. The popularity of Wim Hof has probably got a lot to do with that and now you see a lot of younger guys coming in. It’s become quite a cool hangout place.

Do you think the masculinity at the Ponds differs from the more stereotypical masculinity?

When we arranged to meet, I was trying to think about this… because you don't really think about masculinity, or it’s not something that comes into your head that often. Maybe that's a part of what male privilege is, you know, slightly just bumbling along in your own little way without wondering what it means to be a man at this stage in time or stage in life.

When you do see articles about masculinity, they are probably preceded by the word ‘toxic’ and anything to do with men generally is written in a negative sort of way. Which you can kind of understand, but at the same time, from a male perspective, it does probably get a bit wearisome. It may be nice to see something a bit more positive every once in a while, to get a bit of balance. But then you read stuff about incels or just fucked up versions of masculinity basically… whereas your experiences just are not really like that. So, I don't know if we as men necessarily gets a balanced representation, but it's not hard to guess why. It's not newsworthy, or clickbait-y for the newspapers, “Boring blokes getting on with having a swim”, you know, there’s nothing much to report there.

A guy recently just started swimming here. He’s an Indian guy and just lost his dad. He said he used to swim with him in the Ganges. When he came over, he was having issues with family, being in contact with them. But obviously the whole thing of losing his dad was a big deal. The first time I met him, he just started opening up straight away about quite personal and intimate stuff about his dad. People often refer to the Ponds as ‘Truth serum’. Since he started swimming here. He said he started kind of feeling his Dad and just started a conversation with his dad while he was swimming. He said he didn't really have that swimming in an indoor pool, just up and down, it’s a bit more sterile. But here, he can kind of lose himself in thoughts and let his mind wander. Yeah. It’s probably the different style of swimming that helps with that. Going to the Ponds is more for for the experience of being in water outdoors rather than just thinking how many laps around can I do?

How do you think spending so much time at the Ponds has impacted you?

Actually, there’s something that struck me recently because I met up with a mate. We went to primary and secondary school together but I hadn’t seen him in years. Then via Facebook, him and a few others, we kind of had a little get together and since then we've keep meeting up to have beer and a chat. This mate has spent most of his life working as a primary school teacher, which is a more female dominated role. The last time we met, he was going on about how these little get togethers have become important because he never really had enduring male friendships in his life. As soon as he said that, I realised how lucky I've been. Especially because there's quite a few of us who have been working at the Ponds a long time and, you know, you're not just colleagues, you go through all sorts of shit together over the years and become close knit. Then, with members of the public as well, who’ve been coming here years… just the little chit chat you have morning after morning, you do feel like you become pretty matey after a while.

If I've got time off… if I have a week away I'm good, but if I have two weeks… by the second week I’m missing it all and looking forward to getting back. Just wanting to know what's going on. So my big issue is how I'm going to deal with it when I retire because it's become a social world as well a work world. I don't really do a great deal outside and I’m quite happy coming here and chatting to people all day, not just men obviously but women as well. I know the day I stop working here my whole social world will implode overnight. I need a cunning exit strategy to make up for that.

I’ve also noticed this notion that the Ponds can help people open up, what do you think are the benefits of that?

I don't know if you're aware that we had a fatality here a few years ago, a guy had a heart attack. There were two guys on shift, one was more my age (50’s) and the other was about 30. Obviously it’s a horrible thing for anyone. You just feel shit, just knowing that somebody has died in the place you work, even though I wasn't there and wasn't directly responsible for him. You really feel for the guys who were there because they couldn't have done fuck all about it… just one minute he’s there, one minute he's gone. Unless you happen to be looking straight at them at the time, you've got no chance. It's kind of like your worst nightmare as a lifeguard.

But the way the guys reacted to it afterwards, the older lifeguard just put on this brave face and tried to claim that absolutely ‘no, no, it didn't bother me I slept like a baby that night.’ And you’re just like ‘really?’… just so overtly trying to put on this brave face, which we all knew was bullshit. Whereas the younger guy was much more visibly shaken up by it. Not necessarily talking about at length because there’s not that much to say about it, he knew it was no one's fault. But it’s just a horrible thing to be on the mind, you know.

So the older guy had a near miss later that summer with a young kid and he just went off with stress and never worked again. Even though he was skint and he was desperate for money, he was just like ‘no’. So obviously, there was sort of the post traumatic stress for him. Whereas the young guy is still working with us and he was the one who was kind of more honest about it. It sort of tells its own story of different ideas of masculinity with a 20-year age gap. Just putting on this brave face just really didn't work for him at all and it's quite sad. But that was quite interesting… just the difference in age and just being a bit more honest and open about it rather than this classic macho stereotype.

Yeah, this stereotype that pressures men into suppressing emotion can have terrible impacts on themselves and those around them.

Yeah, a good mate of mine, we go back a long time, worked for the fire brigade during Grenfell. He wasn't on duty that night, but he was part of the clear up operation the following morning.  I spoke to him a bit on the phone, and he was just like ‘I’ll talk about it when I see you’. He said a few things about the sheer utter carnage of it all and just dealing with the aftermath. He talked about one guy, he kind of described as like the ‘fireman’s fireman’. He'd been there, done that, seen everything, and he said the guy was just in bits.

They all went to the pub after they finished their shift. But the mad thing was, they didn’t fucking speak about it, which is nuts given what they just been going through. That was quite scary that. Yeah. It just brings it all home. He came on shift working at the Mixed Pond the next day. As soon as he got there, it was literally the first time he saw me, and he just unloaded about everything he witnessed.

The idea they went to the pub and didn’t even chat about it. That's what I struggled to get my head round. You could see as soon as he got there, he just completely unloaded, whereas he just kept it all in before.

Do you have a favourite memory of the Ponds?

Oh god, I’d probably have to think about that for some time. You get a lot of moments… a lot of different things. Whether it is a conversation, or just coming in and seeing a nice sunrise, or just chilling out on a really nice afternoon. I don’t know if there is something that sums it all up… I think the most enjoyable thing is going back to the friendships that are made over the years, and I wouldn’t swap it for anything. I really don’t have any regrets about all the time I worked here. I genuinely would do it all… or at least most of it again.